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Suspension: Worth it to Repair?

16K views 17 replies 7 participants last post by  Wogger23 
#1 ·
Hi everyone, I tried posting this in the suspension/brakes section but it didn't allow me.

I bought this Mazda 3 (2005) 2.3L in 2009-10 with high mileage - the guy drove between New Brunswick and Quebec alot, so it's mostly highway miles. Since day one the right side strut was defective (bang off potholes etc), and the car handled poorly.
Now I am facing broken coils (in the back), have changed out one rear shock, and now am told the front lower control arms are 'dangerous'. With the struts leaking, coils broken, lower control arms needing replacing, I am faced with a costly repair. I have a mechanic who is very fair, and I wouldn't attempt these things myself - not yet. Now my uncle passed away and his son is selling his 2002 Honda with 168,000 Km , less than mine, but I like my car, despite the rust problem and poor A/C performance, compare to this 'grandpa' car of his. But I don't want to inherit new problems. He wants $1500 for his dad's Honda. Incidentally I drove it and it sounds like the muffler or resonator is about to go, the check engine light is on (or the engine icon), it handle very well (solid) compared to my bouncing and way to low Mazda 3. It's an automatic too, and have been driving shift all my life. But two garages I have mentioned this both agree the Honda is a better car - whatever 'better' means. I doubt it has the comfort and ride of a properly working Mazda 3 - sexier, and nicer car all around.
I am presently not working steady so economics and repair costs are going to be the deciding factor.
I paid $3500 for my 3 in and I see them going for 1.500 $ with less mileage and in supposed better shape than mine.

So in a nutshell I am asking;

Spend the $1000 and fix my Mazda (new suspension) ,brakes, paint job
or Go for this Honda and take my chances with other costly repairs.
Sentimental reasons aside.

I have to move on this quick, before he lists it. ($2000), because I am family he is asking $1500 'as is'.
Btw I was at a cafe on SAturday and the owner bought a 98 Civic of his buddy for $200 and hasn't put a nickel in it - yet !!
Some people have all the luck!

Thanks.
 
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#2 · (Edited)
Tough choice. I just fixed (well my mechanic did) the shocks/struts on my 2004 and cleaned up some of the rust today. The car drives great right now.

The way I do the math is I put aside $50-75 a month for repairs. I did some math and that is what it will cost usually. The $500 I spent today should mean that the car should last me 7-10 months to make this repair worth while. I have spent a total of $1700 fixing the suspension, buying tires, treating rust, etc. in the last 11 months or so. I expect the car to be good and mostly trouble free for at least ($1700/$75 per month = ) 22.7 months to make the expenses reasonable.

I put aside or expense out $100 per month in car payments or towards the purchase of a car. So a $1500 US dollar car should last me about 15 months and not cost me more then (15 X $75 = ) $1125 in repairs over that period. In total I expense out $175 every month to own my car.

I payed $3300 for my Mazda with 209k kms. I expect it to last me 33 months.

What will the Civic need? Tires, shocks, struts, brakes? How are your tires/brakes etc? Check it out, do the math. How long do you think the cars will last? 168,000 km is very low miles for a Civic. Does it need a timing chain? Was it maintained well? I expect it to be good till 300,000 kms with proper maintenance. Same for a Mazda3

I would say if your engine is good and the rust is not too bad, and the rest of the car is ok, then fixing it might be reasonable. If the rust is bad then don't. The rust was not too bad on mine and I think the car will be ok for the next 2 years here in the New England winter.

If you are low on cash it is important to make good financial decisions, to take responsible care of yourself. Perhaps you can get an estimate on the repair costs for the Civic. Not sure how high your mileage is, but I personally don't plan to keep a car past 300,000 kms unless I really like it. Very worn cars will require repairs that take time and money and also make me loose confidence in a car that is taking me to work.

Personally if the Civics engine is in good shape, it sounds like a great deal at $1500. It sounds like a good car and a response-able thing to do for yourself. It sounds like you got a lot out of your Mazda3, 6 years with apparently very little repairs and $3500 purchase price. Nothing to regret in buying another car, even another Mazda3. I would say, sell your Mazda.
 
#3 ·
DearSX,

Thank you for replying, I appreciate it. Your sensible and down to earth views couldn't have come at a better time.
His son messaged me that he is ready to list the car if I don't go for it myself. I don't like to rush things but I understand his sense of urgency.
He said he took it to his mechanic and was told there is nothing at all wrong with the car. He also invited me to bring it to my garage to ease my mind. So I doubt he has anything to hide. But like I said, I find it a little odd, because I test drove the car and noticed the exhaust was loud on acceleration and that engine light was on. The car felt safe and solid, unlike my Mazda. That alone should have clinched it.
No as you say, it does sound like a good deal, but I do not want to inherit new problems.
My last remaining concern is selling the Mazda. Who will buy a car with so much mileage and rust in disrepair?
I would hate to have and scrap it. This would be a no brainer for a competent well-equipped diy'er who can pull the parts from a junk yard and be up and running in no time. Sadly I don't have that option.

That $500 sounds well spent. I am glad you are enjoying the car again. This was the route I was going to take as well. Get through the winter and the Montreal potholes , and wait to do the suspension in the spring. But I must act now. As I said the front brakes need work next.
Well I will list it and see if there are any takers. Incidentally that $1500 is Canadian, or $1,125 USD. Now the taxes are another thing. I paid almost $800 at the 'DMV' for the 2005 Mazda 3 .. That was a shock!

Cheers
 
#4 ·
The automatic transmissions on the 2001-2005 Civics are trash. My understanding is that it's rare for them to last much above 100k miles (160k km). Most go between 60-90k miles. I sold my 2002 Civic when I put in the 3rd transmission - about $3500US for a used one and labor.

I do know someone with 240k miles on a 2002 Civic with the original transmission and one at 135k on a 2003, however I know even more who dumped the cars with blown transmissions or replaced it and then sold. Personally, especially given the check engine light, I'd be nervous about buying a 7th generation Civic. Both the 6th and 8th generation are significantly better cars!
 
#5 ·
The transmission problems in Honda's come from the fact that most owners never read the Owner's Manuals. You're supposed to change the tranny fluid every 30,000 miles. And it's SO EASY to do. Even easier than an oil change.

It's a shame you can't do the work on your 3 yourself. Those jobs like changing the springs, control arms and shocks and struts really aren't that hard at all, and even a complete novice could knock that out in a day.

I like Honda's, my wife drives a 2000 CR-V. I also like Mazda's, I drive a 04 3, and am on my 3rd 3, starting with a 92 323 SE.

I had a 2000 Civic EX before I got my 04 3. The 3 is a much nicer car all around. Better comfort, ride, handling. Only loses to the Civic in gas mileage. I do have to admit, that Civic got some amazing gas mileage. I could squeak 37 mpg out of her if I drove carefully. I've never been able to even approach that in my 3. But whatever floats your boat. Flip a coin, I guess.
 
#6 ·
I would like to tackle some of these repairs myself if I don't need a lift. I used to repair many things on my '97 VW Golf, tools , Bentley etc.
I watched the Youtube tutorial on doing the struts. What do you guys recommend for coil/spring tool, it wouldn't be worth investing in such a thing for a one off job. Btw, I passed on the Honda, it needs too much work, and it wasn't such a great deal. Besides I like my 3 as well. Much nicer car than that plain, unsexy thing ;-) Besides I like to keep my cars and repair them. I have grown quite fond of this one and can't wait to have it fixed so that I can enjoy the ride ! Any tips, links direction on where to buy inexpensive parts for this bugger, in my area , would be appreciated. I do have one mechanic in my neighbourhood who is fair, but he never has time. Right now, the front brake pads need changing. Any direct write ups on these (we sites of gurus) . I will look around the forums in the meantime.

Danke
 
#7 ·
You don't need a lift for any of the suspension work. Just a good jack and a good pair of jack stands. If you're broke, Horror Fraught has you covered. That's the same thing as Princess Auto if you live in Soviet Canuckistan. (You said kilometers, so I'm assuming that's correct).

Changing the struts, you can use a spring compressor. Just better have a DAMNED good vise, and keep your head well out of the line of fire. Otherwise, just pull the struts and take it to a local shop to change the springs over. They should only charge you maybe $20 to do the swap.

Brakes: If you pay someone to change your brakes, turn in your man card. For real. They are SO easy to do. You don't need a write up, everything is painfully obvious. The slider pins are Allen, but I can't remember the size. 10mm maybe? Everything there is cake.

When I did my brakes recently, I found a shop that actually still turns rotors. That saved me a bunch of money. If you don't get yours turned, get either OEM or Centric. Avoid that Chinese made garbage. I also used premium OEM pads. Some people don't like them, but personally I'm a fan.
 
#10 ·
... Brakes: If you pay someone to change your brakes, turn in your man card. For real. They are SO easy to do. You don't need a write up, everything is painfully obvious. The slider pins are Allen, but I can't remember the size. 10mm maybe? Everything there is cake.....
Although I rarely post an issue on advice from another member, I have a big problem with what I quoted from what you wrote.

First off, this advice would only apply to someone who has never done a full brake job (and not much other DIY either), because anyone who has done this work already knows what's involved. So you're telling someone who's never done a brake job to just start unbolting parts and wing it? With the most important system on the vehicle?

Yes, everything is 'SO easy' once you've done a few of them, but how about the first time? Is there any chance of a rookie mistake, like maybe not enough torque on the bracket bolts? What might the worst-case consequences be of someone making a really bad beginner mistake on a brake job?

And how about when the job goes South and it's no longer 'SO easy'? Like rotors badly seized to the hub? Or frozen bleeders and old brake lines that are ready to give out if the wrong thing is done to them? This is a Canadian '04, so IMO almost every type of ugly problem is likely to be in play with this vehicle.

I'm not saying to the OP to avoid DIY - I do lots of it and always try to encourage others to get into it as well. But I also recommend always trying to learn about the job before touching a wrench. And that goes 10X for brakes. Get the manual that Matt listed, read through the entire procedure, and also watch a few VIDs as well.

Go ahead and flame me If you don't like what I had to say, but I'll never back down from what I wrote.
 
#8 ·
Hi theblooms, great post man. Made me feel plumb ashamed of myself ;-)


But seriously I definitely am not aversed to saving some coin here and feeling the sense of satisfaction of a diy repair.
I prefer to work with the shop manual and don't mind paying for it. (I paid $100 or so for my Bentley for my 97 Golf and it paid for iteself in no time at all.)

Can you recommend one for the 3? They have the Haynes series at my local Canadian Tire, but prefer a 'factory authorized' one with complete torque, bolt size, even jacking points, etc.

I agree on not going for cheap Chinese stuff, I will see what my local parts centers have in stock. I will mention those OEM brands you listed , thanks.

I was thinking of getting that combo strut/coil part as used in the 1aauto video on youtube and avoid the tool and risk.
However I was told, one rear coil is busted so this might be an investment.

I will crack open my Bentley and high school auto mechanics books to refresh my memory in the meantime.

Thanks for your confidence.
 
#9 ·
You only need a spring compressor for the front, you won't need one for the rear. The spring fits into a pocket on the control arm so you basically put a jack under it, remove the shock, knuckle, and swaybar endlink bolts/nuts. When you lower the jack the spring decompresses, you pry down on the control arm, and then remove it.

Also there is a PDF of the factory manual here. http://www.mazda3forums.com/95-maintenance-care/273242-service-manuals-download.html
 
#16 ·
You totally misunderstood me.

You have to take the cap off of the master cylinder before you push the caliper piston back in with a C-clamp. And I do enough brake jobs, I actually got a disc brake piston kit that takes the place of a C-clamp. If you only have one job to do every 4 or 5 years, it's not worth the money, I don't think, so a regular C-clamp will suffice. It also makes doing rear brakes super easy because to push those pistons in, you have to turn the piston while simultaneously pushing in. Without the kit, it can be a massive pain in the ass. And with our cars, those little cube things that you get from the auto parts store don't work.

You don't need to bleed the brakes unless you get air in the lines. You won't get air in the lines if you don't open the system. Therefore you don't need to mess with the bleeder valves.

 
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